true to form, guns dont kill people, people kill people. so the cartoon isnt the issue, the people’s reaction thereto is causing the problem.
that’s a given. im just saying, that by drawing the cartoon, you are knowingly poking the dragon. its not like its an 3 year old doing it, and not knowing its not cool.
and true, the muslims are very touchy. as are most religions. but considering there are gazillions of them, and a marginal few are the ones making the noise, its not quite fair to tar them all.
as much as i dont want to be labeled a hedonistic sadist just cause some atheist wherever reach the news coz he killed and chowed his flatmate.
i feel for muslims, cause they are not all koran bashing suicide bombers. the majority of them are just plodding along through life, like the rest of us sods, and quite honestly, dont know better.
its like xtians saying that peoples who lived before they were given xtiandom, were to burn in hell, just coz they didnt know god, like native americans before old columbus came along to save their souls.
im getting off the point. sorry.
the point im trying to make, and have been trying to make, is that innocents are kakking off, all round. some muslim auntie wherever is feeling hurt cause her prophet is being made a mockery of. she doesnt know better. her religion is all she knows. she doesnt have the need to think outside of the box, cause she was brought up to believe what she does. its not her fault, she doesnt know any better. if the cartoon were to bring her to see the big picture, and free her from religious bondage, then by all means. im not sure if drawing cartoons will bring about this objective. it will just cause anger. surely there must be another way.
and unfortunately the muslim society isnt very forgiving. cause their leadership instill this kind of thinking, and anyone that doesnt comply, gets ostracised at least.
at least with xtians, such public mockery elicits debate, and i think, plenty of headway is being made. i just dont think its wise to employ the same tactics used to break the xtian stronghold. one should poke the dragon softly, if that makes any sense.
figure out a way to get under the skin, without causing an outright public bitching-fest.
i think zaps is trying, in his own way, to get the ball rolling, but the direct way, might not be the best way.
quite honestly, i dont think its any atheist or skeptics duty to go about preaching the evils of religion. its not our job. its our job to provide knowledge when asked for it. nobody likes unsolicited info.
getting aggro wont get any results. a bit of tactical cleverness is needed. getting in their face wont do it.
He certainly wasn’t the one that got the ball rolling. Here’s the motivation behind it.
I think that most of the points as to why it needs to be done have been made. It is nonsensical and would set a terrible precedent if people couldn’t draw pictures - cartoons - without fearing for their lives. Where would the line be drawn? What if Manchester United fans got upset and threatened peoples lives and businesses if they are drawn as losers in cartoons, or as someone else mentioned, the ANCYL threatens people who parody Julius (Not that they have to try much!)?
Now that is an honour! Go Zapiro!
For those who think we should just keep quiet and let the cruel sects and cults of this world do their own thing, let an ex-muslim tell you in her own words why silence is not an option. In fact, silence from us, or from moderate muslims is nothing other than complicity.
Please watch:
I don’t see it as my job as an atheist to speak up. I see at as my duty and moral imperative as a human being to stand up and shout in the face of injustice. Whatever form it may take.
“Evil triumphs when good men do nothing”
Just saw this on The Freethinker website relating to what we’ve been chatting about.
http://images.freethinker.co.uk/uploads/2010/05/nohumour.jpg
Zapiro's cartoon made it onto the RDF website. Whooohooo!!!!...and on [url=http://scienceblogs.com/pharyngula/2010/05/irking_accomplished_continue.php]Pharyngula[/url]
I support Zapiro and everyone else that supported Draw Muhhamad Day.Religions should not be given any special consideration. If you want to worship a god/gods then keep it to yourself and leave me out of it. The problem is that they don’t, every religion encourages their followers to convert others to their beliefs. Muslims see non believers as infidels who should be put to death, in fact anyone who disagrees with them is in danger of being killed for being outspoken. Remember Salman Rushdi?
i dont think its any atheist or skeptics duty to go about preaching the evils of religion. its not our job.I don't see any reason why I cannot question those ridiculous beliefs or why I should even respect them.If atheists and skeptics don't question, then who is going to do it? Do we just let religions enforce their idea of morals onto everyone else, like they already do in our everyday lives? Why should I respect religions who wish me to die a fiery death and suffer for all eternity because I'm an atheist and just because I think differently? Hell, I don't think so!
I agree wholeheartedly with Micahel Meadon’s latest blog post, which you can read at Ionian Enchantment.He makes some very good points about this whole argument.
I was googling Freedom of speech and stumbled upon this: Testing the limits of freedom of speech
I still wonder where one draws the line? Is freedom of speech conditional?
Feeling very proud to be South African for a change, I emailed Zapiro’s cartoon around the office this morning and quick as a flash got this response from the boss:
Please be sensitive when distributing material that may be offensive to our colleagues.
Which is weird because nobody seems to object when I rip off Jews and Christians.
Ask for a list of things each individual in the office is going to find offensive so that you can avoid offending anyone…then give your list in!
No e-mails with white backgrounds and black writing…
No jokes about Julius Malema…
No jokes about the Bulls or the Stormers…
Etc…
Brilliant! I’ll try it.
M&G ‘regrets’ cartoon offence
http://www.news24.com/SouthAfrica/News/MG-regrets-cartoon-offence-20100526
On Wednesday Dawes said in light of what the paper had learned since publishing the cartoon on Friday, it decided to review its editorial policy on religion, especially where it concerned the Prophet Muhammad.MMM it seems they get special treatment again.....
DIS-AP-POINT-ING!!!
Incredible how Zapiro can do a cartoon with Zuma raping the justice system and it only causes a small ripple, but his cartoon of Muhammad lying on a couch causes huge waves of contention. To my mind the Zuma cartoon was MUCH more of an offensive-causing picture.
Funny that we never see a headline, “Agnostics Kill Atheists”. It’s ALWAYS religion that causes all the shit. So, it’s against their religious dogma to draw an image of Muhammad - so Zapiro drew a picture of a guy in a turban - which is logically not an “image of Muhammad.” So now their nickers are in a knot and the M&G reviews their editorial policy on religion.
It’s sickening.
"We explained to them that we did not intend to cause any harm and we distanced ourselves from the islamophobic imagery depicted on a Facebook group," Dawes told Sapa.
Is a rational fear a phobia? One should not deny the existence of islamophobia, but when a faith group commits acts of terrorism, issues fatwas that reward murder or intimidates the media, while demanding that the laws and practices of a secular society be amended to accommodate their whims, concerns are no longer unwarranted. By yielding to such demands, we sacrifice the secular state through succumbing to a process of blackmail backed by fear.
If the editor of Mail & Guardian had just distanced the paper from the Facebook group because he felt that they were islamophobic, it might have been acceptable. But he went further: he apologized for a cartoon that should be inoffensive to any rational reader; he sacrificed the paper’s policy regarding religion and the Prophet Muhammad in particular after what they had learned. Here is more than a mere rational reconsideration of the issue at hand or regret about supposed “hurt” that might have been caused - here is yielding to fear.
When such fear, spread by terrorism and threats, goes beyond rationality and deteriorates into a general phobia, it is not because of cartoons on Facebook or in other media, but because of Islam’s own actions.
M & G probably already received their threats via email 
It’s like that one time when they were accused of being a violent religion by some politician, they went rioting in the streets in protest. So not only do they lack sense, they also seem to lack a sense of irony. I agree, Islam are making their own grave. The trouble is that anybody who speaks out against the atrocities in Islam gets death-threats. And everyone is too scared to say something in case we piss them off.
Funny, if their people did the things they do (like kill people, blow up buses and buildings, treat women like shit) WITHOUT the religious slant, the UN would step in, or the USA, or any number of governments around the world. But because it’s all done in the name of their religion, now we all have to pussy-foot around them and apologize for criticizing them. Makes me angry.
A nice comeback from a brave man, who unfortunately has an editor sadly born without balls.
Thanks for posting DNA
Don’t be to harsh on the M&G. Lots of other papers would not have done it in the first place.