are we breeding ourselves into extinction

I did say knit OR weave. I know tons of people who can knit, why pick on the harder thing to do? By the way, I completely understand what weaving is, and I’ve “woven” with grass etc before, just never a garment of fabric. But heck it’s not THAT hard, If I need basic clothing I’m not going to try and weave fine silk anyway, rough weave would do, so would knitting.

who knows how to dig proper irrigation?

Gravity + shovel, I mean if it takes humanity more than a couple of days to figure it out, we’re fucked anyway.

who knows how to build a furnace?

I did say I saw a guy build one, with explanation…

who knows where to dig up the right soil that contains the right amount of iron to smelt?

So all major cities, cars, railways, telephone lines, tables, chairs, earrings, have been vaporised?

do you know how to milk a cow boogie?

I’m pretty sure you don’t tickle it’s ears and make “boooo” sounds…

would you know what to do when your cow has mastitis?

No but at least 5 people in my family do.

does he know where the raw materials come from? no. he just does what the baas tells him to do.

I’ve never set foot in a brick factory but the basics I know. Take clay (afaik almost any clay goes), form into brick, make really hot for long time, cool, serve.

mister baas of the brick making factory just knows how to stick everything together.

I doubt it, mister baas wouldn’t get 2 cm past the SABS if he didn’t have any clue what he was doing, where his materials came from, what their quality was (and hence what their properties were), etc.

who knows how to make cement from scratch? it took people ages to get the recipe right.

Sure, but now we know the recipe. My brother has lectured me all about the chemical composition of cement, he’s in the building industry, and they know this stuff, promise.

how long will take you to build it? do you know how to stack the stones just right so it doesnt collapse on you when the first rain comes.

Hey I’d have the rest of my life to experiment and still that’d only be a fraction of a fraction of human history. And I’m pretty sure I could wax it in under a year, easy.

they cant help you when joburg gets flattened by whatever. they are lank far away.

You’ve never met someone in joburg who came from a rural area?

do you know where to find a painkiller in nature? do you know which willow's bark will help you, and which will give you the runs? do you personally know anybody that does?

But you a pharmacist does, and I know a couple of those… I’ll ask when I’m next around.

wont be handing out their knowledge like candy, they will hang on to it, and you wil kak to get even medicines, tools, cloth...

Nobody knows everything, they’ll have to barter to survive.

where i can get seeds

Any piece of corn, tomato, etc. you find (I have to exclude certain GM crops here, on that you may actually have had a point) will do.

fertilizer

Tip: It’s not on your knee, and it’s not on your chin, but it can be found somewhere in between.

where does one find cotton seeds?

Down in Louisiana, just about a mile from Texarkana.

find a sheep, shear it. cool. where do you buy your shears again? who makes shears? the blacksmith. do you know a blacksmith? how many smithies are there in johannesburg?

You can skin/shear a sheep with a rock you sharpened by beating another rock. BUT do yourself a favour and do a youtube search for “homemade furnace” and be amazed. Some kids do it these days for laughs, some adults who want to make basic stuff, etc. And yes I’ve seen people who blacksmith for fun, youtube search that. My point is not “you could always youtube”, my point is just LOOK at all the people doing it!

you are trying to make it sound like it will be business as usual

Oh hell no, it’ll be hard going at first, but what I’m saying is, getting the basics right won’t take centuries, or maybe even decades. Things would recover pretty quick imho. I don’t claim we’ll be churning out the benzez, but locomotives, then maybe cars… I realise you need certain tooling. But it’s much easier if you already knew what was possible and how. And like I said, talking, writing, reading, we could disseminate information quickly.

there’s an Afr saying “Nood leer” I think it went and it surely does. I built a house from rock without plans and we still live in it; manufactured two massive doors from sleeper wood without ever having done so in my life and many other things on the farm.

But GCG has a point: if ALL amenities were to disappear, the ‘strong’ who know and can, will exploit the ‘weak’ who don’t know and or can’t…no different to today. No pharmacies will exist anywhere or packlaged medicines etc and the knowledge they had as well as the factories, vehicles, fuel etc are gone (and no Google), Faerie’s knowledge would make her a pretty ;D valuable resource…however if you’re on a remote mountain plateau and no way to get down or a desert island with very little of anything, you’ll be forced to survive a la Robinson Crusoe.

So for you it’d be business as usual.

MY knowledge is basic, and its stuff all of you know already, its just not being used therefore not on your mind. Hell, if you read ANY historical FICTION you would have some knowledge on “stuff”. All of us know you use the intestine to make wors with, we ALL know that to cure a skin you need to scrape it, we all know that you yank on a cow’s udders to get milk… - who told you eh? the devil’s in the detail, but that anyone trying can figure out anyway. Whether a green is poisonous? Hey, lets take a wee bit and put it on the tongue… does it burn, is it bitter - yes, spit it out, no, swallow and wait to see if you get the runs, no? try a bigger piece, still ok? Well then its likely safe to eat. Does the birds and animals eat it? Probably ok then. Damn, its not as much fun as picking it off prepackaged from a shelf, and you cant sue someone if it makes you sick, but you’ll be able to eat!

Maybe we should print out the internet and bury it somewhere where we can find it when everything else has been flattened.

quite so :smiley:

heheh…but here’s a thought. IF everything is destroyed and the survivors want to leave some knowledge behind for their descendants to use and develop a new world and you’re allowed only one ‘paper’ (made of hemp by the way!), what would you write (with ink made from beetlejuice and soot ;D)?

I’d draw a map to the place where I buried the internet.

GCG has a valid point in that modern humankind with its technological advances would be quite out of its depth in a stone age situation. The debate here has little meaning unless it is clearly defined what is involved in the starter pack. A sample of, say a few hundred humans, dumped into a wilderness situation with no tools, no transport, and no knowledge of the local geology, would indeed have a very severe survival battle and may well become extinct, depending largely on the availability of food and water. Would anybody in the group have the ability to make a fire by rubbing a stick; to manufacture a wheel without tools? In a scenario like this all knowledge of modern technology would probably be lost and have to be reinvented over millennia.

A situation where all cities have been destroyed by earthquakes would be entirely different. The population would not suddenly be devoid of all tools, resources, transport etc. and should be able to recover to modern day standards within a few generations.