I’ve seen that on more than one occasions, it happens usually whena thread is well and truly deteriorated and it’s what happens when people give in to group thinking and just go off on whatever another person is saying, so it’s more of an emotional reaction than a really well thought out response, but it does happen, but I agree, mostly, yes, it’s something Christians claim you are claiming, even if it’s not, but they do try hard to use that angle, I sometimes wonder if they don’t try and manipulate atheists sometimes into going for those sorts of responses, but hey then you know it hasn’t been about having an honest discussion for a while and it’s about making the other side just look bad while each side flings their poo, but luckily you can press the reset button and calm shit down by pointing out the bullshit both sides said and explaining why it’s bullshit
For me, interestingly enough, it started on game forums. Chatting with the n00bs and plebs, some conversations invariably turned to religion and I was happy to discuss things in a nauseating pleasant manner. I was so indoctrinated to respect religion, faith and the sensibilities of the religiot, that it came naturally to bend over backwards to accommodate them.
I got dragged into it because for some obscure reason I understood that evolution was universally accepted and incorporated into religion (ie God-driven rather than “blind” NS. I can almost respect that view. It aint denying reality nohow). Gradually this perception was blown out of the water. There is an inordinate amount of fuckwits who don’t “believe in evolution”…
So I set out to get the record straight, to change the world, to fix the InterWebs and I argued with these people. Patiently, reasonably, kindly, friendly yet firmly. And I started running into the canards: Darwin recanted, How come there is still monkeys around, It is just a theory, Micro evolution is real, macro evolution is taken on faith, etc etc etc etfuckingc… An endless stream of shit and bile and vomitus.
And one painstakingly explains why these are lies, why it is wrong, why it shouldn’t necessarily break one’s faith to accept observable reality. And then slowly, it dawns on one, these people are batshit crazy. No amount of reason can break through the indoctrination. So one continues the game because it is fun and one learns as one goes along and one plays for the audience, those who sit on the fence.
Then you run into the “more sophisticated crowd” the ID’ers the Thomists. And by this time you are tired of the lies and the dishonesty and the veiled insults. And you have read The God Delusion and no longer think religion deserves special protection or respect. It has done fuckall to deserve it. And you fight fire with fire. Scorching Hellfire >:D The same canard, again!? Fuck it, stick a dynamite into it and blow it to kingdom come!
And I think that is where a lot of people are. Tired of the shit.
Yet I have almost gone full circle. I haven’t ‘debated’ one of these cretins in many many many moons now and only interject a thought here and there when I must.
I hardly think I have made any difference but I have had fun doing it and it is a pleasure to blow a stupid idea out of the water as it deserves. And I think it is important that this fight be fought, every inch a win. Without it, the NGK wouldn’t have made the decision on teh gays they just did for instance. Not a war won, but a war is won one battle at a time.
Did you ever end up on Planet Mars? (If this question is nonsensical you can say no)
As for your larger lament, I’m completely with you and feel your pain.
I had a large group of friends completely withdraw from me because one intrepid social engineer thought at one occasion I took it “too far” by saying that Alcohol (his favourite drug) was worse than Marijuana (THE DEVIL). This person then went around my back poisoning my entire friendship circle against me. Before I knew it I wasn’t getting invited to parties anymore, people went on holiday without me (whereas before that didn’t happen), I was cast out. Completely.
Because I dared question a tiny bit of conventional wisdom with actual verifiable facts?
I had to throw my hands in the air and say “fuckit”. You are right, they don’t deserve an ounce of respect and even when you use kid gloves it can blow up in your face.
agree, and still, at times, I just give up and feel like pulling an apron over my head and go cry in a corner out of pure frustration, one of the reasons I gave up debating the issue and rather just stay well away from these type of conversations. Leave it to the younger generation (my sons) to have a go at it.
horrible but true for me as well, lost my whole extended family because of my views on religion. Not nice but one does eventually get beyond it.