Are there skeptical movements in other parts of Africa? Is there any kind of organisation which support local activities.
I’ve travelled quite extensively in Africa and would comment that skepticism and especially atheism is severely frowned upon as is investigative journalism. This doesn’t mean they do not exist but the very strong cultural and mysticism-bound people of especially rural areas would be poor soil for liberal thinking. Maybe the universities would be the breeding ground and creative groups like musicians, writers and painters etc. It’s worth exploring though.
On a continent where most of the people routinely visit witch doctors, and the Tikoloshe still has millions of people raising their beds on bricks… I have to say the skeptical movement is pretty weak.
yeah, i allso regret to say that the skeptic movement on our continent is few and far between, as your life sometimes just isnt worth it.
obviously, the more learned a society is, the more such discussion is abound. but i would assume it’s contained in studies and kitchens and bedrooms.
pity really, this continent could do with a solid dose of reality.
Does education makes the different. And is there a negative influence of evangelical groups. I heard that thousands of then plays a role in local society.
education helps but in many schools in Africa Religious education is almost a compulsory subject especially in the earlier classes. In addition, hundreds of schools are linked to churches and missionaries as are many hospitals and NGO’s. At university level thousands of black students still take religious studies as a possible subject ‘because they want to help their communities’. Missions exist all over Africa and especially Islam is very active, building new schools, donating medicines and generally infiltrating the halls of power. The African mindset requires massive change from an external locus of control to an internal locus of control. This is also evident in many languages, e.g. when you play golf, your (black) caddy may say when you hit a shit shot “the tree stopped your ball” or the cleaner in your house may say when she drops a cup “the cup fell out of my hand”. These are broad generalisations but you get the point?
Except through this forum, I’ve only ever met two other atheists that I know of, and one died. 
It sounds like rescue the panda bear :-[. Is there a marketing problem. Have you ever been abroad. Invite atheist from infidels (for example)to join and develop the community. My home base (freethinker.nl) counts almost 1500 members. I’ll think that 1000 of them are atheist. Skepp (Belgium) has also a majority off atheist. Almost 40% off the dutch people has no religion. But most of them are not interested in any kind of atheistic material.
I didn’t know that the Islam makes such a progress in Africa. I always heart the christian evangelical viewpoint. Save the souls of the African people make them christian. And many dutch churches sent people to Africa. To realize this idea. I apologize for the shit they have brought to you. I understood the generalisations; nice to read this.
Same scenario, aside from my S/O, I personally dont know any other atheists. Morbid stuff.
There’s far too much woo in Africa, and its interesting how many africans can marry their cultural woo with xtianity. Many traditional witch doctors pray to the xtian god before they do their stuff. There’s a adaptation of praying through their forefathers to god (much like having Mary as an intermediate in the Catholic church)
And Pietv, hells bells man, dont apologise for something you had no hand in…
Here’s another insight into the woo in Africa pietv. I was in Sierra Leone shortly after the cessation of the rebellion (working for the World Bank). Our project leader for the demobilisation and reintegration of the rebels was a Ghanian PhD in Economics. He firmly believed that JuJu worked! JuJu is the black magic that rebels carried with them in combat: wearing it rendered them immune to bullets and made them invisible to the enemy: if they got hit by bullets the excuse was invariably that they had not used the ‘right’ JuJu! It was also here that I witnessed 6800 child amputees (long sleeves or shortsleeves in a rehab camp! I also actually held blood diamonds in my hands…could’ve brought out a canfruit bottle full if I wished! A beautiful country fucked up by the greed and mysticism of Charles Taylor and his cohorts.
With amazement I read this information. That superstition plays a large role in many parts of Africa is no secret. But on this scale is new to me.
By the way: Are there members from Tanzania or Zambia (for example)? Are books by Dan Barker, Dawkins, Stenger, etc. sold in these countries?
I spent a year in Tanzania and most books are available as in Kenya. In countries like Eritrea (10 visits) getting hold of books is very difficult. The biggest problem is that people are generally poor and cannot afford to buy books and TV is normally state controlled except in the more developed countries. Churches, mosques and African denominations (animism and ancestral worship etc often combined with western religions) become in many instances the sole source of information, community activities, weddings, funerals etc. Obviously folklore, withchcraft, spells, human sacrifices (especially of albino’s) child muti (child parts!!!) are strong medicines and as was the case in ancient Europe, the strong exploit the weak!
There is no public library? Have you ever noticed in this period some discussion about religion on TV or public rejection of biblical dogma.In the Netherlands are always heated discussions about religion on television. The controversy between evolution and creationism is fought.
I never visited any public library in these countries and would suspect that they (if they exist) would be poorly supplied. Censorship is very evident in some countries (e.g. in Eritrea the Jehovahs Witnesses were banned from the country)and they are Coptic Christian and about 30% Muslim. I never saw any debates re evolution vs religion on TV, but that doesn’t mean they didn’t happen. You can imagine how evolution will be interpreted in a country where the general literacy rate is poor, mysticism is the order of the day, churches control schools etc. Even in the USA the fight is fought daily between the woos and (r)evolutionaries.
I would like to add to this discussion if I may (Hi pietv, and welcome).
Research has shown (and I can’t remember who the researchers were) a definite correlation between the general education level of a country and its belief percentage. The guy from Ghana with a PhD is an individual surrounded by woo, grew up with woo, and had nobody else challenge the irrational beliefs … so as a result never really thought about it.
My own father here in SA has 3 engineering degrees, and a PhD in patent law, and was even chairman of Mensa Pretoria for many years - but he is still a Christian and refuses to discuss the subject of religion. He is in his 80s now but he grew up here in SA where nobody ever challenged (or seldom challenged) Christianity. But these days there is a gradual change. Plenty of young people are now challenging their religion and there is a definite trend towards rational thought and atheism. I’ve had contact from Christians - both English and Afrikaans, black and white - and Muslims (Indian folk) who have had questions regarding their particular woo. And many of them have ended up atheists.
My view is that we are living in an exciting time of discovery. In the past there were all sorts of “frontiers” to explore and discover. Now we are crossing the woo-frontier.
Yeah, I also saw that on Dawkins’ site. The article does sort of give one hope, but now I want to move to Britain.
I am interested in this ICM study. Do any of you know where to find it?
But you have to accomplish a task in this area. Nowadays African missionaries come to the Netherlands. They said it’s more necessary In each country must be a forum which promotes skeptical thinking. But that’s still a long way to go. Does anyone know Maarten 't Hart. A Dutch writer.