Shitty funeral

Majin finally lost a very close family member after the protracted saga we’ve been trying to deal with lately.

She’s asked me to vent on her behalf on the crappyness of what has ensued… the sting is still a bit too much for her.

So this weekend we ended up in a charismatic church in pretoria with a conglomeration of semi-astranged family and congregation members. There was a number of things I found just strange, weird, annoying, and downright irritating.

Cheifly the problem is being in a group like this and knowing that speaking up and making these people think about or consider the truth is just a bad idea, won’t achieve anything, and it’s really not the place for it either. BUT then why must I endure all their bullshit? So point 1: Religion is so one-sided and in my “respect” I just let it be, making the problem worse. But I can’t really see a healthy alternative. Especially not on a dark day like that.

Being Afrikaans there’s a level of assumed “Christian-ness” that the average person in a church won’t think twice about. Obviously this meant a lot of “(s)he is in a better place now” being flung around as a consolation. Here’s the problem: To a skeptic this just repeatedly rubs in the fact over and over that the person is dead and you will never see them again. To the skeptic, this kind of BS makes matters WORSE, not better, I really felt for Majin about this. They also played some gospel song by some chick (in afrikaans), that is supposedly your loved one speaking from the grave trying to console you by telling you how awesome heaven is and they’ll see you soon. I just wanted to puke at that point. But it got worse…

Then the pastor got to evangelising in a big way. The sermon became not so much about the dearly departed, or consolation (even though there was a fair amount of course) but more about converting any strangers that may be in the church that normally wouldn’t be there. I have to see his logic in this, not every day a bunch of strangers walk into his church as a captive audience. Oft repeated was “If there are any non-believers here today you need to look at the death of this person and repent and give your life to christ … blah blah usual schpiel”. I won’t elaborate on all the different levels that sentence pisses me off, but it’s just riddled with those. This is a pet pieve I actually had from early religion days: Why is church so horribly one-way? I wanna be able to put my claw up and ask questions damnit! (Ok I just answered myself, that’s the last thing they want, but… that would be awesome)

Then the most tacky part came when a “church elder” of some kind came up and read yet another letter written in-the-first-person-voice-of the deceased. More of “Death was a gift not something to be sad about” bullshit, “I love X and Y and I’m so glad that Y and Z”… I could go on all day about the BS being spouted that upset me, and my dear loved one, even more than actually being there to bury a very close family member.

For the most part we just sat there not praying, not singing, and generally me watching M being battered with BS at a time she was at her most fragile.

By the end of the day, I felt incredibly sad for the human race. At least, the religious part of the human race. Reality is just such a huge affront to their sensiblities… They seem SO weak to deal with the truth, that they tried their damn nearest to re-enforce something they probably suspect is false, by repeating it over and over and over to eachother all frikkin day, Non-stop, every way you turn, the same sentence came time and time again. “It’s OK, better place, (s)he’s happier now in heaven”. It is just so blindingly obvious that these people are not, or do not want to be, capable of dealing with the possibility that they someone else may die. The repetition exposes the insecurity they’re trying to hide. I could smell the fear hanging in the air thicker than ever before.

I can understand their sadness. I can understand their pain. I can actually understand their need for consolation. However I don’t think by the end of the day they felt any better than I did. Not at all, I don’t buy it. When someone dies you get your heart ripped out and stomped on and it takes a long-ass time to recover. That’s just the truth of it, and I don’t think religion is ACTUALLY making a measurable difference in these people’s hurt (I have to wonder aloud whether this has been investigated, or how you would establish a metric…)

The longer I stay away from religion the more bizarre, fucked up, and ultimately sad and pathetic the people in a church appear to me. And like I said in linked thread before, they make matters for those close to them so much worse in the process. Whilst being absolutely oblivious to it.

Actually, just absolutely oblivious. Period.

Which is why I dont attend funerals (or weddings or baptisms or… any of that shit)

You know what the really awesome thing about being atheist is to me, I have no fear whatsoever of death, something which I dreaded in my xtian days (I’m going to burn in HELL!), now I view it as something that will come to pass, all I hope for is that it will not be in pain or prolonged illness.

Consolations to both of you, its not an easy process.

Condolence to you and Majin, BoogieM. :-[

I just let it be, making the problem worse. But I can't really see a healthy alternative. Especially not on a dark day like that.
Neither can I unfortunately. :( It would be great if we have a solution to this. Perhaps just what we are doing, actually talking about it is helping already. I grew up in a time when one couldn't even ask questions without being sidelined, marginalized and thought of as satanic.
"If there are any non-believers here today you need to look at the death of this person and repent and give your life to christ ... *blah blah usual schpiel*".
Damn them to their hell for this crap >:(

when my dad died, the pastor spent zero time actually talking about him. none of the ‘better place’ scenario. basically going on about how the sinners are to burn in hell, and so on and so forth. if i wasnt so fucking heartbroken, i might have gone up to him, and said, ‘oi, stfu!’
nobody spoke about him, nobody had anything nice to say, and it just seemed like an excuse for the choir to get in some practice. it was really not a nice event, nonwithstanding that it was a funeral. i know my dad did not want to be buried from a church. and yet, his wife did what the hell ever she liked. ironically, she is a groot kokkedoor in the church, and yet, her two daughters, are both born out of wedlock, to different fathers. and the youngest was pregnant with twins at 16.

It would be great if we have a solution to this. Perhaps just what we are doing, actually talking about it is helping already. I grew up in a time when one couldn't even ask questions without being sidelined, marginalized and thought of as satanic.

Quite, having an open forum like this to gripe without being publicly slammed is a nice change of pace.

Damn them to their hell for this crap

One sometimes wishes there was a hell for these people to go to. I guess having their hopes dashed by NOT waking up is a shallow retribution, albeit they’re not there to appreciate the folly.

Of course, people who come back from the brink and say they saw nothing are dismissed, and people who “see the light” get all the attention they could possibly get. Confirmation bias is strong with this crowd.

Which is why I dont attend funerals

Strangely I find this a cathartic experience that helps me let out and find closure. Somehow physically seeing someone being put in the ground gives me release. Unfortunately I can’t think of ever even hearing of a secular funeral. Possibly it doesn’t happen.

none of the 'better place' scenario. basically going on about how the sinners are to burn in hell, and so on and so forth

My word that is just rubbing it in even for your religious stepmother. We also got some fire and brimstone talk. I have this funny feeling someone informed said minister that there were atheists in the crowd. I’ve never gotten quite such a directed-at-the-unbelievers preaching before.

Strangely I find this a cathartic experience that helps me let out and find closure. Somehow physically seeing someone being put in the ground gives me release. Unfortunately I can't think of ever even hearing of a secular funeral. Possibly it doesn't happen.
I've already arranged for mine: I am to be cremated without any preaching; my friends will attend a 'wake' where they will all be entertained with my mampoer and relating stories of my life; a party will be held to celebrate my life not my death (hopefully!) Fortunately my family are all in support of this and have sufficient respect for my wishes and my memory. Some of my friends are religious but it will my occasion, not theirs. I'm almost looking forward to it! >:D And if my cancer returns, I'll call all my family together say cheers and quietly bow out... 0:)

Perhaps the religious sceptic’s biggest frustration is that you’ll never have an opportunity to say, “Didn’t I tell you so!?” :wink:

More seriously, it’s worth making a point of reminding the deluded many of the good the decedent did in life and what they meant to others, rather than keeping quiet when they start jabbering about the afterlife. Silence is all too soon mistaken for consent and false hope is ultimately always worse than no hope at all. A clean hole is sooner fixed than one that’s full of ash and dust.

BTW, congrats to cyghost on the millennium edition!

'Luthon64

/OT Thank you, I almost missed it. :smiley: And now with a 1001 posts I can finally lay the rod down, surely the execution has been stayed.